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  #31  
Old 05-31-2007, 03:49 PM
HiGeez HiGeez is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

Sure I would buy an aircraft from NewWeiner. You'd buy a truck from "Peterbuilt" right?

HiGeez
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  #32  
Old 06-01-2007, 02:35 AM
Leon Leon is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

and yeah, Wiener Neustadt meanst New Vienna City
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  #33  
Old 06-01-2007, 04:54 AM
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karoliina karoliina is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

Still, while it has problems, Thielert is about the best you can get. We have still the Thielert diesel on our flying club's Cessna. I still do not hesitate to fly with it. I may be cautious after maintenance, but other than that, I think it is a good engine. And it is not true that the hp would be a problem, because in Thielert, the problems have been mostly elsewhere, e.g. in supporting systems. For example power loss because of reduction gear wrongly assembled at service center, engine quit because the air intake was blocked by turbo tube which was forgotten to be fastened at service center. I guess there have been also other things like that, in case of Thielert, it matters how it is assembled (torque etc. has to be exactly as specified by Thielert).
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  #34  
Old 06-02-2007, 09:38 AM
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

I saw a Wilksch 120hp (with Jet AI, about 10% more with european car diesel) diesel installed in a Europa AC at todays Swedish EAA fly-in.

Great installation, this is a 3 cylinder engine. A 4-cylinder 160hp is under developement. No need for electricity in this one, direct drive, turbo and compressor (gives 50% with a broken down turbo)

... promising for my future needs (RV-7)
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  #35  
Old 06-02-2007, 09:48 AM
Leon Leon is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

yes the wilksch principle sounds good to me as well...
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  #36  
Old 06-02-2007, 01:47 PM
chasingmars chasingmars is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon View Post
boy, the guys out there with the 1.9 liter diesels in the passats and so on, go and run your engine at 3840 rpm for an hour. it feels horrible, it sounds horrible.
I've done this. Heavy trailer, open stretch of Canadian highway, WOT (well, wide-open-injectors! )for about 4 hours doing 130-140+kph (uh, no, I mean, just over the speed limit )... not quite 3840rpm, but 3200ish in fifth and a lot of time higher in fourth, in my 1.9L TDi.

What is interesting is that I've never seen my temp gauge do anything other than point directly up at 90C, after warming up. For a while I thought it might be broken, it was so consistant. In town, highway, -30, +30, doesn't matter... I want to know how they plumb their cooling systems!

Car didn't complain in the slightest. In some ways, diesels are better engines for flat rating than gassers.
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  #37  
Old 06-02-2007, 02:23 PM
deuskid deuskid is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon View Post
boy, the guys out there with the 1.9 liter diesels in the passats and so on, go and run your engine at 3840 rpm for an hour. it feels horrible, it sounds horrible.
Leon -

I've owned a passat and a jetta both w/ this engine over the course of 5 years [traded the 96 passat after buying it with 120k miles on it and put 80k more for the 98 jetta with 120k miles on it and sold the jetta for more than I paid for it after putting another 100k miles on it. They ran like tops and I never had a lick of trouble with either car. I now wish I had kept the Jetta [although my Civic Hx gets ~ 50 mpg as did the jetta].

I didn't experience your observations at all with either vehicle of my diesels. I wonder if you have owned a TDI?

Given your other diesel observations I wonder if are objective?

Each engine choice is a compromise in some area.

Diesels do what they do better than gassers.

ymmv

John
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  #38  
Old 06-03-2007, 03:26 AM
Leon Leon is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

@chasingmars

afaik the temp gauge in the vw's is more of a "guesso-meter" which is averaged out, and more or less just shows "cold, normal, hot"

at least thats what my mechanic here tells me

@deuskid

yes I own a diesel, as I have stated in quite some threads before. My guess is you didn't read my post as thorough as you should have. my car currently has close to 80 k miles on it, owned it since new. big ARL (engine code) 1.9 liter with 180 HP (chip) and 4wd in a Golf. runs like hell, no problems ever, BUT like i said ( maybe you have overread ) its simply material strain i dislike. and running an engine at close to 4000 rpm (which is quite close to the "rev limiter" although new diesel don't have a rev limiter but just reduce boost) is not my idea of being nice to your engine.

how the f**k should I be ovjective when I've flown 140 hrs in diamonds with thielerts, have had many problems with these engines (power loss down to 30% in 13.000 ft over the alps (very high mountains in europe for the geographic geniouses out there )
was grounded for weeks (added up) because engines failed ( and thielert couldn't deliver a new one), had to be replaced (see before), had electrical problems and so forth. I have postet before what problems we have had with the thielerts.
i'd love to try the 4.0 in the cirrus, just to see if its any better, but from what i've read in magazines about the engine, it doesn't really cut it any better, sadly

i will state it again, just for you
i like diesel and i would love to have one in my a/c one day. but certainly NOT a 1.7 thielert. i have owned a bunch of diesels and plan on buying one again after my current vehicle.

my personal prejudice :
any engine with less that 6 cylinders won't be mine in the future (unless rotary, or flat subaru boxer, and even then i'd prefer the 6 banger)
any diesel-engine w/o turbo won't be mine in the future
any engine that says thielert 1.7 on it will never be mine (after what i have experienced)

thank you for your patience and reading
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  #39  
Old 06-03-2007, 12:04 PM
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Dennis Passey Dennis Passey is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

If HIS experience was your experience, he would be just as objective as you ,and would be claiming YOU were the guy who had a freeking closed mind...thats the way it goes with peoples 'pets'. HMMM...Its a great looking dog but it does vigorously hump peoples legs without provocation. [but THAT ankle humping stuff is SUCH A LITTLE THING-you can OVERLOOK that now can't you?] You are treading on holy diesel aircraft ground LEON because that engine is many peoples sacred cow of powerplant hope. You are poking your finger in the eye of aircraft dieseldom [reducing its Theilurt systems reliability to the derided Lycrosaurus realms] and they don't like your OPINION.
I am always puzled at the Theilurt discussion here because it has no place in our world. They won't even sell it to us experimental users. So 4 cyl/6 cyl- turboed or tractored- it isn't going in a Cozy.
Go point your finger of experience in another direction- its viewed as JUST your OPINION, and not to be embraced with validity. Personally, I think we here in the experimental world should have our eye on Kumaros and what he is seein'. Ku is the source for good diesel auto stuff thatcould actually go into the birds we're building.

Oh and by the way..thanks for your posts..in American media we would call that 'balanced content'.
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  #40  
Old 06-03-2007, 12:23 PM
Leon Leon is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

hm, i'm not realls sure if what dennis wrote was good or bad for me

but still, he's right

and yeah, Kumaros has a feel for these things, but we do think along the same lines sometimes
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  #41  
Old 06-03-2007, 12:39 PM
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Clutch Cargo Clutch Cargo is offline
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Lightbulb Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

Personal prejudice can be a powerful thing with or without good reason. Advertised it can have profound effects. (See racial prejudice)

If I had as much time flying (or gliding or sitting with hyper -tightened sphincter) as Leon did in the aircraft under scrutiny, I would feel the same way.

I remember once eating at Burger King (Fast food restaurant like McDonalds only not) I got a hamburger with a chunk of bone in it. The next 3 hamburgers had a chunk of bone in them! Maybe it was a fluke. But now, thanks to conditioned reaction (See Pavlov's dogs) I won't eat a Burger King hamburger (even with my head cut off!) even though the chances of getting a chunk of bone are now even more remote than ever.

I also remember flying my 73 Rockwell Commander from Nags Head, NC To RDU. About 20 minutes after takeoff, I began to wonder if I had tightened the oil dipstick. It haunted me and I watched the oil pressure gas and the windshield for any signs of a leak, and watching for airports to land in case I had to land. The Commander had a mid time IO-360 which never had even a slight problem, but that day I was worried. The Beech 18 I flew in was a different story: "One turns, the other burns" as in DC-3s and other radial gas guzzlers. But even with the problems they still flew. I didn't enjoy flying the Beech 18. It was a lot of work and often when I got out of the cockpit (even if I wasn't the PIC) the place on the seat where I was sitting looked like an upside-down ice cream cone!

If I had to face the possibility of an engine failure from having a personal history of such in an aircraft as Leon has and especially with the forbidding emergency landing sites available, I would probably have a few choice words about and to the proponants of the engines in question.

As far as Theilert is concerned, they can sell innovation, power and all the things Karolina has praised them for, but they can sell dependability -yet!
They will have to earn it first (as far as Im concerned). Losing trust is another whole ball game. Right now they're 5 runs down at the bottom of the 9th . Somebody better get a new game plan, or they may lose that expensive franchise and who will want to buy the team and it's baggage after a bad season?

PS I wrote this while Dennis was posting. It was good about you. I think Dennis and I are brothers from another mother except he isn't as repressed when it comes to speaking his mind as I am!
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  #42  
Old 06-03-2007, 01:18 PM
Leon Leon is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

I will say this about the thielert

as long as they run, they're really really nice to fly with. quiet, efficient and really easy to handle.
AND none has ever failed to a stop on me in flight.

and yes, it's mostly anciliaries going (turbo, alternator, main wiring harness and so forth) but still, you won't be in the air long if one of these things fail to a stop.
30 min of engine time w/o alternators, then the engine stops.
30% of power w/o the turbo (not enough to stay at any altitude >1000ft MSL and not even sure about that)
irregular engine instruments and rough running, power loss up and down the ladder with a defunct wiring harness

so yeah, the engine won't stop dead right away in most cases, but won't keep you flying long ... and as I said before, all this presuming you have nice VMC conditions. But I promise you, you'll sh*t your pants if your in full IMC, maybe at night, over some high a*s mountains ...
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  #43  
Old 06-03-2007, 01:30 PM
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Kumaros Kumaros is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

As Nasreddin Hodja "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nasreddin" would say: You are right, and you are right, and you are right, Leon and Dennis and Clutch. In my opinion too, until Thielert engines have proven reliable, they aren't worth the US$ 20k or more they are asking. On the other hand, a Mercedes Benz engine out of a wrecked Mitsubishi Colt with just 11k km on the clock for EUR 1500 is certainly worth considering, even if it only holds up for let's say 500 hours. Considering the stuff one can get out of the car, seats, power gadgets etc., and the stuff one can sell, doors, alloy wheels and tires etc., the engine ends up costing something like EUR 500. So, for EUR 1 per hour for the engine and about EUR 10 per hour for fuel, this is the engine for me. I'll follow in Al Wick's footsteps in his original Subaru installation and try to keep the auto-conversion as close to the "auto" as possible.
On a personal note: with financial problems finally out of the way, the house construction can take its course and be finished in a couple of months. Then the project will literally take off :-) I'll keep you posted.
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Last edited by Kumaros : 06-08-2007 at 10:52 AM. Reason: correct spelling
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  #44  
Old 06-03-2007, 01:32 PM
Leon Leon is offline
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

oh boy Kumaros, I wish you all the best ! get it up and running ! I will definitely come to greece and visit when you're done (by then I hope to have a decent cockpit job settled. looks like air berlin oder lufthansa regional at the moment)
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  #45  
Old 06-08-2007, 03:14 AM
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Default Re: Diamond DA-40TDI made forced landing to sea, in front of Helsinki

3rd hand informtion say that the cause of the problem was some clutch part in the gearbox that failed. :-/
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