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  #1  
Old 09-24-2007, 09:51 AM
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Default Hot Wire saw and templets

Well, i have now cut cores for wings for 2.5 planes and vert stabs for 4 planes. I have had templets made out of formica, plywood with a copper edge( A REAL disaster cause the copper tape came off during the cut), Steel, and aluminum. I have used the plans saw and a spring loaded saw, nichrome, mig SS, inconel wire.

Results

formica templets, ok but wire twangs on it and line appears in the pieces
plywood - see above
Steel - good but the person who made them did not file and sand the edge, so they were only mildly better than formica
Aluminum - PERFECT - i spent allot of time making them - the edge was filed with bastard and then mill file and then polished off with crocus paper. The effort was worth it! Having a glass smooth templet cutting surface made the hardest piece (vert stab) much easier to cut. nearly zero lines from pausing, nearly cause the top templet is so small compared to the bottom one the top person is hardly moving during the cut, 1/16 inch or so per second!

I also spent over an hour putting cloth wire markers on the templets and the time was well spent. as i had centered the cloth numbers and letters on the hash marks, following them was very easy.

Spring loaded saw versus manual tightening saw.
Well, for ME this was a PIA to do cause i kept buying springs that were too wimpy, three trips to the hard ware, but, i must say the effort was well worth it. Once the saw was set, no untensioning during the cutting session was needed, once i tightened the turnbuckle i had installed cause i just felt i should.

Nearly ZERO wire lag, the extra time it took me to make the saw was well worth it. BEST CORES EVER. Fun stuff

The wire - all worked the same - no difference detected

Cores Done!
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  #2  
Old 09-24-2007, 10:44 AM
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David Clifford David Clifford is offline
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Just as a gesture of good will and generosity for a fellow builder, I have assembled a collection of my favorite precision tools to assist Dust in removing those ugly and aerodynamicly inefficient vertical stabilizers from his wings. They will stand at the ready as will I. Just give a shout when you are ready!
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  #3  
Old 09-24-2007, 10:48 AM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

heh heh heh - they actually have a planned use - test paint

I will fill and sand em, take em to scottsdale and let em bake in the sun for color testing, but, thanks for the kind gesture
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dust

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  #4  
Old 09-24-2007, 11:43 AM
argoldman argoldman is offline
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dust View Post
I have had templets made out of formica, plywood with a copper edge( A REAL disaster cause the copper tape came off during the cut), Steel, and aluminum.

Cores Done!
Dust, you left out one material, that is probably the most used, easiest to fabricate and easy to utilize.

That is Masonite (or whatever they call it today)

Use the untempered stuff (easier to cut and finsih, lighter also, just don't drop it on an edge)

Easily cut to shape with a band saw, and sanded smooth. Works well with the hot wire, and unlike the metal counterparts, you don't get the cooling proximal to the templates.

If you are doing production then the metal ones are better as they will last through repeated uses.

However if you are doing production, use computer directed XY frame stuff (cad/cam or whatever)
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Old 09-24-2007, 11:48 AM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Well, ar, can't imagine masonite working as well as the aluminum, did not notice any heat loss to the aluminum. cut is perrrrrrfect.

i am now gonna make the lower winglet templet cause i might want to install them at a later date, once i do, these templets will be put in circulation.
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  #6  
Old 09-24-2007, 01:19 PM
argoldman argoldman is offline
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dust View Post
Well, ar, can't imagine masonite working as well as the aluminum, did not notice any heat loss to the aluminum. cut is perrrrrrfect.

i am now gonna make the lower winglet templet cause i might want to install them at a later date, once i do, these templets will be put in circulation.
It actually does, and it is so much easier to cut and smooth than aluminum. (I have used both) Too late for you at this stage, however.

For circulation, AL is better!!!!Good on ya for making these available

AR
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  #7  
Old 09-24-2007, 02:29 PM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

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Originally Posted by argoldman View Post
It actually does, and it is so much easier to cut and smooth than aluminum. AR
Yes, specially cause i cannot cut like tmann - i cut real fat, ground on 6" belt sander, then on to bastard file, then to mill file, (skipped mill/bastard) then on to crocus paper, or did i use 80 grit zircon in between,mmmmmmm can't remember now

I just can't imagine anything working better than the aluminum and would only maker them outa it in the future.
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dust

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  #8  
Old 09-24-2007, 05:55 PM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dust View Post
Yes, specially cause i cannot cut like tmann ...
For my templates, I cut the out of 16 gauge aluminum, painted up the backside and transferred my numbers onto the new white surface. Looks good enough ...... but the I clamped them to a new piece of 16 gauge and traced them out. After I did that I took a small washer as a gude and traced them again. The only part of the profile I didn't mess with was the spar cap cutout. All the wholes line up on both so the lager template goes on first then the true profile. I use the numbers on the true profile for the talking numbers during the cut.

After the hotwire cut, I remove the oversized templates and use a 6ft piece of 1 x 6 extruded aluminum with 36 grit on one side and 60 grit on the other and take 0ff the remaining .125 inch of foam the 'Berkut' way.

Time consuming but it's right the first time.
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Old 10-11-2007, 10:21 AM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

When in kansas I used the "berkut" way of wing cutting. cut to oversized templates and sand to finish templates.

First, the templates were poorly finished, the edges looked like they had been band sawn and left that way. it made for very catchy cutting, not good.

second the sanding templates have been used many times and the sanding board that was used was merely a flexible 4 foot piece of chip board, not a rigid flat sander.

I question how close to plans these templates are after many uses, i think they have been sanded down to undersized.

Thirdly they do not cut the spar trough separately like the canard templates do. this leaves a curved and not crisp spar trough, because of wire lag.

I think the sanding templates should be compared to the plans to see if they really do match up before use.

Hey, I brought them back from RR for Lafleur, they are in my garage, maybe i should just go in the shop and check em.

heh heh heh, i will

Fourth - they are oversized and do not fit on the 7" foam, i dragged the cut on the wing root and they was not enough material to sand to shape.

My opinion, the cores would have been better if good smooth to size templates were used with a spar trough cutout instead of the all in one plans method.
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dust

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  #10  
Old 11-12-2007, 10:23 AM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Well, went to the hanger yesterday and while i was there i took the templets to compare to the plans.

What I found surprised me.

overall the templets were slightly too small, but only slightly, except for the leading edge.

from the nose to the spar cap trough most of the wing templets were 3/32 too small.

If the undersized condition was caused by sanding i would expect the problem to be more uniform. I think this shape was the way they were originally made, a flatter nose section

mmmmm - if i made em, i would not use em, i would remake em. BUT if i borrowed them, as these are borrowed, would i use em cause many have?

I can't answer that as i have my wings, i can only pose the question.
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dust

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  #11  
Old 03-03-2008, 08:40 PM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Well, here is my new mini hot wire saw. took pics of the wire wrapped at th ends to show how to make neat twist at the end and not use up wire cutting length. At rough river those who were rewiring the saw after the break were going to use an inch at each end in a looooong twist.

The day before - had no saw rack - PIA - now i have one with hooks for tightening wrenches. No need to muck with spring tensioning on such a short saw
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dust

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  #12  
Old 03-04-2008, 08:06 AM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Looks just right for blended wing radii. Is it a one person saw?
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  #13  
Old 03-04-2008, 09:32 AM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Always a two person saw - each one has to carefully follow the hash marks. mmmm - i been thinkin on the wing blend - might be possible to cut it once i figure out the radious's, that would be my preferred way
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dust

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  #14  
Old 05-04-2008, 09:25 PM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Finally got pics of my spring loaded hot wire saw - worked great - spring is very, very, very hard to pull back
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Enjoy the build,njut av byggandet, godere il costruire, nyd bygningen, geniesse den Bau, apolafse tin kataskevi, disfrute la construcción, curta a construção, Pidä hauskaa rakentamisen parissa, bouw lekker,uživaj grade?inaslajdaites postroikoi, geniet die bou
dust

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Old 05-05-2008, 08:27 AM
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Default Re: Hot Wire saw and templets

Maybe between your camera and Steve's, you can put the two together and make one that will focus and flash.
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