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  #1  
Old 06-25-2008, 12:14 PM
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Default Firewall FIRE solutions

By now we all know what happened to eracer - we just don't know why.

In my opinion we have forgotten why the firewall is called FIREWALL.

We put holes through it, we should not, unless a bulkhead fitting is used and the firewall remains sealed. the cowling is pressurized, for cooling, and air will migrate to the cabin without proper care. This must be stopped.

Jack had a huge hole granted, 6 inches in diameter sealed with rubber grommet and aluminum firewall. Stainless Steel is good heat shield material, aluminum is a heat sink material.

I will have fire resistant bulkhead fittings where ever i puncture the firewall.

All of that will be EZ except for the heat vent, that will take some thinking

Jack's words to me were that he could not have made it another 15 seconds more in the smoke filled cabin.

Last year we lost the blond streak to fire on the ground.
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  #2  
Old 06-26-2008, 12:10 AM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Figured out the cabin heat problem - just need a 2" or so butterfly or other valve at the firewall that can block off any air in case of engine fire.
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  #3  
Old 06-26-2008, 08:51 PM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Use a metal ball valve instead of a butterfly valve. Or use a metal "guillotine" type valve.

Aluminum is a horrible firewall material, burns too easily.
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  #4  
Old 06-27-2008, 11:09 AM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Yep - some kids of metal valve to allow closing and stopping fumes from entering the cabin. Should not be too difficult to find - course i always think that.

But that is not the only hole, EVERY hole in the firewall must be treated the same with fire resistant closing or fitting.

Just treat it as the name implies
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  #5  
Old 06-28-2008, 12:47 AM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Next point is controls, eracer lost aileron control, i will replace all flight control bearings and fittings in the firewall area with SS or fire resistant material
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  #6  
Old 06-30-2008, 10:54 AM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Well, my buddy the weldor helped me with the layup yesterday and we looked at the firewall - he can make all the brackets out of SS in quick order on the sheer and brake at work, once his welding for the intake manifold is done.

not much aluminum and other materials to get rid of, but will take plenty of time - it all does!

aluminum rivets on steel tubes, wheels for the cables, etc, etc

I have to learn from others tragedies, eracer lost aileron cause we forgot what a firewall should be
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  #7  
Old 06-30-2008, 09:19 PM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Aluminum wheels should be okay. If retracts, one of the first things the pilot should do is extend the landing gears. Hanging out in the breeze, the aluminum wheels should be okay.

If they are not, then the pilot has worst things to be concerned about!

Edit: I realize now that Dust is referring to control wheels, not the landing wheels with rubbers on them!

Also note aluminum fittings on fuel lines, etc.. Eracer mentioned that the heat from the fire expanded the aluminum fuel line fittings, causing them to come loose and made things worst. May be worthwhile to use all steel fittings and braided lines.

Also consider what to do about the control tubes? They are open to the engine compartment to the IP? What is the best way to seal them?
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  #8  
Old 06-30-2008, 09:57 PM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Well, i think i just have to determine if there is a fire- turn off fuel - i bet i end up with a camera.

most of the control tubes are steel per plans - just have to get rid of rivets and bearings and brackets and wheels and ... and ...

just plane keep plane controllability

i'll keep a lst
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  #9  
Old 07-01-2008, 11:22 AM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Well, these are fiberglass, spelled it burns, planes so ifin you have a fire, once discovered you must get it out, if possible, so that would mean turning the fuel valve to off.

Interesting that most of the fittings are steel in the engine compartment, but not all. For me, all it will be. Not a big deal, just time a and a little money.

i will use steel fuel lines and probably steel fuel fittings, but the engine is aluminum!
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dust

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  #10  
Old 07-02-2008, 01:20 PM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Firewall pass through - if it goes through the firewall - a fitting must be used. People are putting oil lines through the firewall to cabin heaters, not a good idea.

the lines should be attached to a bulkhead fitting at the firewall. oversized washers on both sides to spread the load, probably should have put a hard point in to stop loosening, the wood in the firewall will compress over time

I found Stainless steel air box bulkheads for hot air transfer to the cabin - standard stuff - we just ll need to follow good standard firewall pass though procedures and solid control materials, bearings, connections, wheels. All heat resistant.

Look at the firewall, if it is flight controls - get rid of the aluminum
If it goes through the firewall - use bulkhead fitting

Check the fittings annually or semi annually, the bulkhead to engine fuel fitting is always suspect of wear or loosening because of the engine movement and the firewall non movement.

plan for the worst - accept the best
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dust

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  #11  
Old 09-29-2008, 02:30 PM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Well, happened again - engine fire and the cabin filled with smoke - this time on a velo - TREAT THE FIREWALL AS A FIRE WALL - MAKE It and all pass throughs FIRE RESISTANT.
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dust

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  #12  
Old 05-27-2009, 10:57 AM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Small step, a buddy found these and they are ordered

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/4X816

Firewall is a firewall and flight controls need to be fire resistant under the cowl
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dust

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  #13  
Old 05-28-2009, 12:31 PM
argoldman argoldman is offline
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Agreed that controls aft of firewall should be fire resistant, however do these parts fill the bill? Their operating max temp is in the 200 degree range. Additionally, it looks like a lubricated bronze bushing captured in a stainless steel pressing which is bolted to the firewall

The cozy uses an oilite bushing floxed into the firewall, possibly a more robust arrangement.

Better Yet are the Cozy Girrrlllllls Ball bearing through firewall bearings. If mine were not already in I would go for those, and may ultimately retrofit.

Take a look at their catalog
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  #14  
Old 05-28-2009, 02:27 PM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

got the parts, will not work, they are for the wing root, not the firewall.

I will go to the industrial bearing store and find what i like, don't particularly like the roller bearings, need an oil environment.

Have decided to shield the wing root outside the controlls with thin SS and silicone mat, that will stop the bearing and the bearing attach point from heat far better than just worrying about the bearing and control tube.
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dust

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  #15  
Old 07-09-2009, 03:39 PM
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Default Re: Firewall FIRE solutions

Will probably use these from jd

http://www.InfinityAerospace.com/HBwArm.jpg
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dust

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