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  #1  
Old 02-28-2005, 01:22 PM
ipasgas1 ipasgas1 is offline
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Default Ratings and experimentals

I recently totalled my MCR-01 Lafayette Sportster after I lost my engine at 2500ft and made an emergency landing on Reading Road in Cincinnati. Luckily, my daughter and I are both fine. I still wish to fly but am unsure about the single engine idea and my wife says she will never get into a single again. I have been looking at 337's as you don't have to worry about the Vmc and that flipping over thing would not help the wife's confidence. I see a couple of defiants for sale. How do they compare with the 337? I assume the same multi training with CLT endorsement would be needed. Any idea on maintainence, fuel burn, value, dependability, etc? Thanks for any info, Dan
  #2  
Old 03-02-2005, 06:02 PM
Wayne Hicks Wayne Hicks is offline
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Because the Defiant is an experimental, you DO NOT NEED a twin rating to fly it.
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  #3  
Old 03-02-2005, 06:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne Hicks
Because the Defiant is an experimental, you DO NOT NEED a twin rating to fly it.
Really?

so by that logic, you would not even need a ASEL to fly a ez?
  #4  
Old 03-02-2005, 09:29 PM
Marc Zeitlin Marc Zeitlin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shrike
Really?
Wayne is correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shrike
so by that logic, you would not even need a ASEL to fly a ez?
Whatever logic you may be attributing to the FAA, for whatever reason, there's no scaling function. Ex-Am Built aircraft don't get certified as twins (or triples, or quadruples, or singles).

Wayne did not address the intelligence (or lack thereof) in flying a defiant (or any other twin engine aircraft, homebuilt or not) without a Multi rating, just the legality of it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dust
performance is probably better on the defiant on 2 0320's versus 2 o360s
Not really. Talking to defiant folks, cruise speeds seem to be in the 150 Kt region, with O-320's - with O-360's, it's in the COZY region. According to:

http://www.superskyrocket.com/pages/.../history_2.htm

The normally aspirated 337's cruised in the 165 Kt. region.
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  #5  
Old 03-03-2005, 11:08 PM
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so one wouldn't need a seaplane rating to fly an experimental seaplane?

you say to look it up..... If it is not excluded, can you show where it is specifically allowed?
  #6  
Old 03-04-2005, 08:54 PM
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Cozy Girrrl Cozy Girrrl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Zeitlin
Wayne is correct.

Whatever logic you may be attributing to the FAA, for whatever reason, there's no scaling function. Ex-Am Built aircraft don't get certified as twins (or triples, or quadruples, or singles).

Marc, this being the case, what about Complex (full retracts) and HP >200HP?
...Chrissi
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  #7  
Old 03-04-2005, 10:31 PM
Don P-Factor Don P-Factor is offline
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You really need to think on this one. I read an article about getting your MEL rating in an Air Cam (Twin) and how that actually meets the FAA requirement for multi training. You are then under the FAA as having your MEL. If operating an experimental MEL can authorize you to operate a certified MEL then the reverse must be true. You must have a PPL SEL to operate an Experimental aircraft. You must have a SES rating to operate any Sea Plane Amphib. It seems unbelievable that one could be able to operate any MEL SEL MES experimental etc... without being signed off by the FAA. The guys at Aerocomp had to get a waiver to operate the new Jet without being Type rated. I specifically asked how they could test the Jet without being Turbine rated. Answer.. during testing if it could be demonstrated that you could fly and land then the FAA would grant the Type rating. Using this as an example it must be regulated by the FAA. Don.

P.S. I could be wrong.
  #8  
Old 03-04-2005, 11:03 PM
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all I ask for is some factual information. I am not tring to be argumentative. Just looking for something more than some bar room theory resulting from a "friend of a friend who knew a CFI" who said so.....or something like "Wayne Hicks said so...."

And as Chrissi hints at, would the same theory would allow a pilot to fly a experimental without a high performance sign off??

Just thinking about how one would explain that to the feds during your ramp check - or after a loss.... and what would your insurance company think??!

If this is the case, all I ask is for someone to educate me by showing me where the FARs exempt Experimentals from catagory and class pilot rating requirements...hint, you should find this in part 61.

PS.... I did personally call Wayne a unreasonable after he told me to "go look it up". I responded with a kind "show me where it is specifically approved...." then he said "No, you go look it up."

Nice reply via private message Waynie. Now show some intelligence and counter what CFR14ch61 requires......and Wayne, quit the wimpy private message attacks....If you have something to say, say it here.

I am interested.....

although starting to see why some leave this forum and don't come back....

Last edited by Dust : 03-07-2005 at 11:30 AM.
  #9  
Old 03-05-2005, 01:45 AM
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MSires MSires is offline
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AAAaarrggghhh,
You guys (and girls) are going to make me go buy a 2005 FAR aren't you.

I'm not going to post anything definite until I do, but I think some are confusing aircraft certification requirements with airman requirements. For example, I believe the wording for turbine powered or >12,500 pounds is in the airman qualifications, not the aircraft. All aircraft, whether certified or experimental, have to have a stated max gross. If it's over 12,500 pounds, you can't fly it without a specific endorsement, whether it is experimental or not. I believe the wording for airman qualifications is the same for all the other required endorsments/ratings.

Storms off to order a current FAR/AIM.... Grumble Grumble - I hate reading.

Mark
  #10  
Old 03-05-2005, 10:19 AM
Wayne Hicks Wayne Hicks is offline
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Dust:

Please remove me from this list.
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  #11  
Old 03-05-2005, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne Hicks
Dust:

Please remove me from this list.
This list is self-inflicted...
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  #12  
Old 03-05-2005, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
This list is self-inflicted
Yes, and it's not a perfect communication medium. Sometime we say things we wouldnt say while sitting face-to-face around Dust's kitchen table. Sometimes we come across in a way we didnt mean.

Come on guys. Lighten up and enjoy it for what it is - imperfect, but useful none-the-less.
  #13  
Old 03-05-2005, 12:16 PM
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So wayne continues to PM me, even though I asked him to spout his wisdom here.

Look Waynie, I NEVER said you were wrong - I just asked for you to show me where a pilot was allowed to do away with catagory and class rating requirements of FAR61.....

Then you get so defensive and tell me to go look it up....

All I ask is that if you are going to start saying something that might get someone grounded, get their insurance denied, or license revoked... you at least cite your evidence!

See, all you had to say is ..." If you read 14 CFR XX. paraxx subpart XX" you would see......" or something like that.

Think you are needing to chill a bit.

Again, I never said you are wrong - just show me where it says you can ignore cat and class pilot requirements!

Just trying to learn.
  #14  
Old 03-05-2005, 12:51 PM
Remi Khu Remi Khu is offline
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Part of the experimental building process is education. I believe that one needs to take responsibility in looking up resources and not expect to be spoon fed. Certainly we can all learn from the experiences of others and can readily receive opinions. However lashing out at another in public reflects badly on the individual. I would like to think that this forum is better than that!!

Wayne, I implore you to remain for you are a valuable contributor.

Just an opinion.

Remi
  #15  
Old 03-05-2005, 02:51 PM
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At this point, 'lighten up' is not what is called for. On other lists, one unlearned person who seems to have no significant accomplishments using adolescent badgering behavior toward a respected and knowledgeable member who has respectable accomplishments within this endeavor and within the aerospace industry itself, and who has seen most of these discussions several times before, would get you booted. Shrike is not a poster I wish to read and certainly won't reply to. Struggling with someone to educate them is not of interest to me. You try to answer their questions and bring them up to speed but get insults in return, why?
 


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