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  #16  
Old 02-10-2007, 09:25 PM
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Clutch Cargo Clutch Cargo is offline
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Question Back to the topic, I mean it!

Anybody want a peanut?

Seriously though, doesn't the laminar flow wing need more velocity than the "hershey bar" wings of it's slower counterparts, ie 150s, 140s, 172s....??? to lift?
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  #17  
Old 02-10-2007, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deuskid View Post
trying to resist... trying to resist... the pull is too strong... can not refrain.... aaaarrrggggghhhhhh....

<I my hokiest non-pc pseudo-hispanic voice>

I do not think you know what you are asking for me to not
not say...

'I do not think you know what that words [sic] means'...

sorry....

self constraint is at its low ebb especially since in another thread someone was just lamenting that the quick repartee' [lame might be more applicable in this instance] has been lost in this forum...

signed [with a flourish]

the swordsmith friend of Pirate Roberts
ok you lost me.....
did you mean candy ????
http://www.robscape.com/store/produc...roductid=16153
i dont get it, girls help me here !
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  #18  
Old 02-10-2007, 09:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deuskid View Post
just as a nod is as good as a wink to a blind horse

so a paraphrase is as good as an exact quotation in casual conversation ...

and so..

no...

I believe I'll respectfully not defer to your pedantic insistence upon exactness but rather...

employ the joys of good enough for gov'ment work [or the girls with whom we date [depending]]....

when not building nuclear power plants

ain't nobody gonna fall out of the sky and die because of a paraphrase .... there is a time for preciseness and a time for laxity. Some folks are lax too much... some too little...


Balance


is everything.

John
A Pedant is a person who overrates or overuses book learning or pure technical knowledge. Such a person values simple knowledge, (in the form of often obscure facts and rules) over common sense and more general knowledge. are you picking on marc ?
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  #19  
Old 02-10-2007, 10:13 PM
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That was actually.... coherent.
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  #20  
Old 02-10-2007, 10:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Zeitlin View Post
OK, so after a bit of research, the CAFE formula is:

CAFE = speed^1.3 * MPH * payload^.6

Gary Hertzler's VE came in at 170 mph, 48 mpg, and 400 lb, for a score of 1.38 million.
CAFE = speed^1.3 * MPG * payload^.6

I think you mean MPG not MPH.
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  #21  
Old 02-10-2007, 11:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarbleTurtle View Post
That was actually.... coherent.
Scares me and I'm fearless!
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  #22  
Old 02-10-2007, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
a time for laxity
Would that be as in "laxative". What could you possibly be suggesting, John.
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  #23  
Old 02-11-2007, 01:34 AM
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Dennis Passey Dennis Passey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarbleTurtle View Post
That was actually.... coherent.
Marb- did you notice that he didnt misspell anny word there either?!...and pedant, heck he's been reading in the bathroom again. Maybe it was the 'laxative'...
Luv ya Stevo =]
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  #24  
Old 02-11-2007, 02:22 AM
Marc Zeitlin Marc Zeitlin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mplafleur View Post
CAFE = speed^1.3 * MPG * payload^.6

I think you mean MPG not MPH.
Correct. Typo.
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  #25  
Old 02-11-2007, 02:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Passey View Post
Marb- did you notice that he didnt misspell anny word there either?!...and pedant, heck he's been reading in the bathroom again. Maybe it was the 'laxative'...
Luv ya Stevo =]
lol
OK then help with this, just did the lip in the back top of the fw and it showed two small left and right side thingies made out of plywood(M7)
i did the 8 lay-up for the mounts long ago
i think my thingies are part of the fw and there for i must have did the lay-ups over the thingies and not before.
add 2 more bid ? 4? never mind it ? re do it ?
i looked at johns web for a clue, and saw his temp fw is the same as my final one and his has the side thingies on it as well. but alas, could find none of his final fw before glassing the hard point..
i photo shopped it to show the thingies and the glassing. if you look close, note the outer right side(the part that has no paint on it) that is where i raped the glass around on the hard point. hopefully you can see the difference between what i did and the plans way, any help here will be gladly payed for with a kiss.

i got more pic's to help show the problem
you can see the plans tracing overlayed and i included the pic from the plans to show my confusion, and a over all shot of the lip.
this post is lost is space and wont come up under new stuff.........rats
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Last edited by Steve parkins : 02-11-2007 at 06:30 PM.
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  #26  
Old 02-11-2007, 02:26 AM
SteveWrightNZ SteveWrightNZ is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarbleTurtle View Post
That was actually.... coherent.
proper use of sentences, capitalization, and paragraphs even.. shocking..

S
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  #27  
Old 02-11-2007, 03:51 AM
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karoliina karoliina is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Zeitlin View Post
OK, so after a bit of research, the CAFE formula is:

CAFE = speed^1.3 * MPH * payload^.6

Gary Hertzler's VE came in at 170 mph, 48 mpg, and 400 lb, for a score of 1.38 million.

Let's assume a COZY will cruise at 200 mph at 20 mpg with a 1000 lb. payload - the score is then 1.23 million - closer to the VE than I would have expected, but hardly 3 million. The best I could finagle the #'s to be would be to use the MPG and speed #'s from CAFE's review of Mark Beduhn's COZY MKIV - 186 mph, 28 mpg, and the 1000 lb. payload. Then the CAFE score would be 1.58 million.

According to the EAA, the Catbird's CAFE score was about 1.31 million - not far from the COZY.

So I WILL use Inigo Montoya's quotation on myself :-).

I am curious, though, where you got the 3 million score from......
I was thinking this too and it might be that the parameters were not correct I used for calculations. I just went to your page, took the alleged optimum cruise: 6 gph at 12000 feet, 160 kts, 50% power. If you base the calculations on this, you'll get over 3 million. It was a bit surprising that it got bigger number than Diesel Diamond DA-40 but if it remains below 1.5 million, then simply the DA-40 is clearly a more efficient aircraft then (the DA-40 consumption figures are based on real comsumption & speed numbers from our flying club's plane and not something I read from somebody's web site).
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  #28  
Old 02-11-2007, 03:58 AM
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elipsese, particularly four in a row, are not correct, according to "Chicago Manual of Style". neither are two.

of course, capitalization is also in order..............!
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  #29  
Old 02-11-2007, 04:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clutch Cargo View Post
Anybody want a peanut?

Seriously though, doesn't the laminar flow wing need more velocity than the "hershey bar" wings of it's slower counterparts, ie 150s, 140s, 172s....??? to lift?
Laminar flow has nothing to do with stall speed.
Gliders that have stall speed of 60 km/h = 32 kts do have laminar flow wings.
And so has many "LSA"-planes, such as Aerospool WT9 Dynamic. WT9 Dynamic in EU configuration (=lower max allowable MTOW when registered as microlight/ultralight) stalls in 27 knots at EU gross weight. However, laminar flow can reduce drag which results more top speed or more efficient gliding performance in case of a glider. Some basic things which are teached just on a PPL-course to every pilot candidate: A wing always stalls at the same angle of attack, not at the same speed, stall speed is determined as a speed that reaches the angle of attack where the wing loses the lift when the airflow separates from the upper surface of the wing and becomes highly turbulent. When you slow down, you need to increase angle of attack in order to keep from losing altitude. When the angle of attack in relation to the airflow over the wing reaches the critical point, the airflow separates and the wing no longer has lift and as a result the nose goes down.

The design choice of choosing laminar flow wing has no direct relation to stalls speed, for example a turbulent profile can stall at high speed and vice versa.
But laminar flow airfoils usually stall at lower angle of attack than their turbulent counterparts which I believe is the idea behind using the Roncz profile on canard
and the turbulent Eppler profile on the main wing -> when the canard stalls at lower angle of attack than the main wing, the plane theoretically don't ever go to deep stall.
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  #30  
Old 02-11-2007, 12:20 PM
deuskid deuskid is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve parkins View Post
ok you lost me.....
did you mean candy ????
http://www.robscape.com/store/produc...roductid=16153
i dont get it, girls help me here !
Inigo Montoya was a character [a sword-smith] in the Movie "Princess Bride" and responded to another character [his boss] who kept saying: "Inconceivable"....

Great movie - I highly recommend it as a film the whole family can enjoy.
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