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  #16  
Old 07-01-2005, 10:56 AM
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OPTIONS, Its all about having the option to guarantee that fuel is NOT flowing.

When I lost part of my prop several years ago, the engine was shaking so violently, I'm still amazed that it stayed on the plane. When I pulled power, I also turned the fuel OFF, as I had no clue what had happened in the engine compartment, or what had broken or torn loose. What I did know, there was NOT going to be any gasoline being feed to the engine compartment.

This is the whole purpose of the OFF position.

Will you ever need it? Probably not.

Waiter
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  #17  
Old 07-01-2005, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Slade
Number of NTSB reports that blame the accident on fuel starvation because they found the valve in the off position when, actually, the pilot selected off as standard operating procedure prior to a forced landing..... who knows. I know of at least one.
the ntsb and the faa tend to find something and leave.

my buddy the accident investigator was more thorough. he would use water finding paste to check if the engine ingested water and he would just plane add fuel and start the engine. Completely check the fuel system, etc. etc.

he never investigated an engine fire, but hundreds, if not thousands of other problems.

some things make sense and some make uncommon sense. i don't argue with 25 years of accident investigation, but i do not always do exactly what he says - he does not want me to put in a backup oil pump - i am, but will pay extra, extra, extra attention to it.
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  #18  
Old 07-01-2005, 12:37 PM
Nathan Gifford Nathan Gifford is offline
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I can also say I know of one that happened over twenty years ago at Lakefront Airport. They attempted to land with the fuel selector knob on off instead of both on their Cardinal. Rumor has it that they sued Cessna over it.
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  #19  
Old 07-01-2005, 01:18 PM
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I think I have about 1,000 hours in Cessnas , and never touched the fuel selector. It always stayed in BOTH.

In fact, I can't remember where its at!

Waiter
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  #20  
Old 07-01-2005, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waiter
I think I have about 1,000 hours in Cessnas , and never touched the fuel selector. It always stayed in BOTH.

In fact, I can't remember where its at!

Waiter
thats what i figured - most do not cycle the selector - i do it every time
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dust

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  #21  
Old 07-01-2005, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
thats what i figured - most do not cycle the selector - i do it every time
Your one of the guys that will turn it OFF!

Waiter
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  #22  
Old 07-01-2005, 03:12 PM
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On every check list i have ever used - it is on the list twice - it is there twice so that it is checked properly Twice I only cycle it on the first check, but i do check it twice each and every time
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  #23  
Old 07-01-2005, 03:17 PM
Mark Molava Mark Molava is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne Hicks
Mark:

The Weatherhead is a popular, inexpensive valve that doesn’t stick. From the Cozy FAQs on Marc Zeitlin’s site (http://www.cozybuilders.org/mail_list/cozy-faq.html)

Most IO-360s with the Bendix fuel servo do not require a return line to the fuel tank.
I read all the posts from the the "Fuel Systems" section and now have a popsicle headache I thought that fuel injection engines needed a return line most preferably to the one you are drawing from. I'm not even at the stage where this is important but I am not building from chapter 4 straight through to chapter 24. I'll be skipping around to best utilize my build time. I'll be placing my fuel selector and throttle quadrant in the same position as your Wayne. I noticed you are using an Andair fuel selector with an io-360 engine. What model number did you purchase?

Having a forum such as this is a good thing. I'm sure I will be able to copy someones fuel installation when the time comes. No need to reinvent the wheel.

I'm new to this whole homebuilt aircraft thing and will have a thousand questions that at times will probably sound ridiculous But after I'm done I'll still probably have a thousand more.

Thanks everybody,

Mark
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  #24  
Old 07-01-2005, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
I thought that fuel injection engines needed a return line most preferably to the one you are drawing from.
I don't think the standard IO-360 needs return.

However, If I was returning fuel, I would say the number one choice is to return the fuel to were it came from. That valve Dust has is PERFECT.

(here we go again)

Waiter

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  #25  
Old 07-01-2005, 04:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waiter
OPTIONS, Its all about having the option to guarantee that fuel is NOT flowing.

When I lost part of my prop several years ago, the engine was shaking so violently, I'm still amazed that it stayed on the plane. When I pulled power, I also turned the fuel OFF, as I had no clue what had happened in the engine compartment, or what had broken or torn loose. What I did know, there was NOT going to be any gasoline being feed to the engine compartment.

This is the whole purpose of the OFF position.

Will you ever need it? Probably not.

Waiter
I'll just turn off the fuel pumps.
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  #26  
Old 07-01-2005, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
I'll just turn off the fuel pumps.
Does that guarantee no fuel flow past the firewall, i.e. no gravity or suction feed?

Waiter
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  #27  
Old 07-01-2005, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waiter
Does that guarantee no fuel flow past the firewall, i.e. no gravity or suction feed?

Waiter
No gravity feed; the sump will be below the fuel rail.

No suction; need pressure for the injectors.

Try turning off the fuel pump on your car and see how far you get ;-)
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  #28  
Old 07-02-2005, 07:20 AM
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I was curious if the pump would allow fuel to flow when its OFF. Could fuel be pulled (or pushed) through it? My test case is to sever the fuel line where it goes through the firewall and into the engine compartment.

I'm laying out an EFI fuel system for my LongEZ and will probably mount the pump in the hell hole. I probably won't get around to installing the system, but I want to get the plumbing installed while I have everything torn apart.

Waiter
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  #29  
Old 07-02-2005, 01:25 PM
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Not having played with any aircraft only fuel pumps, I can only speak from my experience with Auto fuel pumps and yes, you CAN draw fuel through pretty much all of them when they are off provided you put enough suction on them. Fortunately this degree of suction will not be provided through the fuel injection system. if you had a carby and it was blocked, then maybe..(think putting a rag over the carb while cranking to pull fuel through to prime a dry system or fuel dilution of the oil due to a faulty choke mechanism, in both cases extra fuel can be pulled out of the float bowl and fuel lines by the vacuum)
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