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View Poll Results: How many have had a gear up landing
one 8 14.55%
more than one 0 0%
None 15 27.27%
not flying yet 32 58.18%
Voters: 55. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 11-27-2006, 11:55 AM
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Default How many Gear Up landings do we have?

So - lets count em - i kept the results secret
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  #2  
Old 11-27-2006, 12:16 PM
Remi Khu Remi Khu is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dust View Post
So - lets count em - i kept the results secret
To whom?
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  #3  
Old 11-27-2006, 12:19 PM
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Secret to all - no one, not even admins, can see who voted which way
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  #4  
Old 11-27-2006, 02:47 PM
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I'll fess up in public;

I put a check mark in the "ONE" block.

It was the best landing I ever made, (Los Banos, CA). Fortunately, I didn't have a passenger and there wasn't anyone at the airport (that I'm aware of). Its amazing how hard the "thunk" is when the nose impacts the runway, Stops pretty fast also.

Did I follow the checklist? To the best of my memory, I did.

Did I have a warning system? Yes one of those little pukey LEDS that I thought I would see. ( I now have a 120db klaxon horn, the same that is installed on every military jet I've ever flown)

I silently snicker to myself when I hear someone say this will never happen to them, as they follow the checklist religiously, or the warning light will get their attention; All I can say is, I hope your right.

(SIDE NOTE: I know of one person who retracted the nose gear just after touchdown in order to stop on the remaining runway. This was an emergency dead stick and touched down with less than 500ft remaining.)

Waiter
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  #5  
Old 11-27-2006, 04:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waiter View Post
I now have a 120db klaxon horn, the same that is installed on every military jet I've ever flown
Ah, the you now need to change your pants horn. I flew a plane once that had one of those type horns. I pulled the power back to make a descent and I about pissed myself when it started blaring right in my ear (it was right above the pilots head)
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  #6  
Old 11-27-2006, 05:15 PM
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Here's what works for me: As I'm descending into pattern altitude, still quite far from the airport usually, I slow to 120 knots and drop the nose gear. My cue to do this is passing through 2000 feet AGL. Then check again on downwind.
If your normal procedure is to put the gear down when you are in the pattern, it's easier to get distracted looking for traffic, talking on the radio, etc.
I fly often and rarely ever stay in the pattern doing touch-and-goes. But if there is a low ceiling and I want to fly and stay in the pattern and do that, then I just leave the gear down.
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  #7  
Old 11-27-2006, 06:53 PM
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I am happy that my bird is not a retract.......just the thought of a gear up makes my stomach queeeeezy.

Chris
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  #8  
Old 11-27-2006, 07:11 PM
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The RAF have a good way to remember.

The final radio call is "Call sign - final, three greens". Sometimes you say it, then check, so the call becomes "Finals, three greens...sh-' if you're a bit slow letting off the transmit button .

This didn't stop one of my buddies coming over the fence with "something missing". I was #1 for take-off. I saw it and shouted "Call sign - Wheels Wheels" when he was at about 50'.Spoolup is sooooo slooooow when you're in a hurry. He didn't quite touch the belly of the plane. The incident cost him a couple of inches off his transponder antenna, and a lot of drinks at the bar that night.

His comment - it was really weird flying along 3 feet BELOW touchdown height.

His SC's comment next day took 30 minutes with the door closed, and 4 hours remedial training.
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  #9  
Old 11-27-2006, 07:15 PM
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Being totally diligent, Buly & I both did gear up's as part of our flight testing. We needed to get a feel for the gear up stopping distance so we would know whether a chosen emergency landing site would work or not - right Buly?
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  #10  
Old 11-27-2006, 10:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Slade View Post
Being totally diligent, Buly & I both did gear up's as part of our flight testing. We needed to get a feel for the gear up stopping distance so we would know whether a chosen emergency landing site would work or not - right Buly?
Good catch J. winnnnk wink. Are you recommending this as an addendum to the Cozy flight manual?
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  #11  
Old 11-27-2006, 10:26 PM
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Default Testing one two three...

Of course John, as a builder you have to test the entire scope of the aircraft's capabilities, which would include gear up smash testing, or "pucker up" for the hockey puck test...

On Marc's list there has been a little back and forth about the need for a warning system. I'd have to go with no. A system is not needed, but it would be nice to have. Having flown mostly retracts over the last 30 years and not having a "gear-up" and not even close, even when the electric failed on final at night, my training and landing routine always eliminated the failure scenario.

My take would be this: There are many important things to do while flying. Do we need a warning for everything? If you depend on a warning, what if it fails? How do you get your butt up in the sky knowing you may forget something while landing, THE most important part of flying.

I guess it depends on your experience and your point of view based on your experience. If you're a novice and building your own plane it seems logical to throw in anything that would seem to make it safer, easier to fly and more comunicative of possible and existing problems. If you have been flying awhile without such bells and whistles, you tend to rely on the things that got you home safe and without scrape-age on the aircraft. Why add complexity?

So I would say there is no right or wrong about it, just what you can or can't live with. But I wouldn't under estimate good training and recurrent safety training, it's gotten a lot of pilots down on the ground without major incident for many, many years. We are of course, the monkey with the lever in our hands. No matter what you have to remind you to do what you're supposed to do, if you DONT do it when your supposed to, it's still going to be counted as pilot error. So make sure the monkey will do what he's supposed to do, because he can do it! And do it does every day with only proper training.
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  #12  
Old 11-27-2006, 11:36 PM
SteveWrightNZ SteveWrightNZ is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clutch Cargo View Post
There are many important things to do while flying. Do we need a warning for everything? If you depend on a warning, what if it fails?
and how do you know that too has failed ?

I agree with Clutch. I think it is a dangerous message for the plane to send - "you don't have to think or remember - I will do it for you." Life isn't like that.

I have landed the X-Plane Cozy nose-wheel up, once. I dont recall what the scenario was, but I found it quite a shock. X-Plane is not the real thing, but the lessons it teaches are well remembered.

The area of automation I will automate fully, is the autopilot system. A good autopilot should do exactly what it is told. Hold this airspeed, alt, climb +-rate, angle-of-bank, airspeed, and any combination thereof, and it should be fast and fully intuitive to use, without taking my hands the controls. Oh, oops, rong thread.. scuse.

s
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  #13  
Old 11-27-2006, 11:45 PM
Buly Buly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Slade View Post
Being totally diligent, Buly & I both did gear up's as part of our flight testing. We needed to get a feel for the gear up stopping distance so we would know whether a chosen emergency landing site would work or not - right Buly?
John is right. He first showed me how's done properly with me in the right seat in his plane. John has a voice warning system which we properly ignored.
Than I did it in my plane with me in the left seat with the check out instructor next to me. I the auto extension feature, but there was a leak in the system.
Bottom line, it is not hard to do. Just give it some time. I feel sorry for the guys with full retracts. In my case, we flew couple of hours after the event.
Full retract would have been a budget disaster.
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  #14  
Old 11-28-2006, 12:16 AM
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ok, i have the auto extend, putting on improved skid plate, will install klaxon horn, but i dun understand how air leak could disable extension, would not it show a low airspeed to the unit and then the gear would extend? or did it kink and hold preasure in?

need more words

komagar (micronesian island "thank you")
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dust

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  #15  
Old 11-28-2006, 01:03 AM
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Here's an opportunity for somebody to make up little decals to be affixed to these aircraft for each nose grind. Just a little thing, maybe a little bird beak scraping on a little runway.
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