An SQ2000 builder

[David Staten]

Originally Posted by Dust

That is funny, they will sell to a 6 cylinder franklin and not to a 6 banger continental!

Well, Nat did report that his 180 hp franklin did not produce the HP that the 180 hp lycoming did.

Whats funny about it..

They haven't had problems on the franklin engines. They HAVE on the continentals. IVO doesn't sell the prop to be placed on an engine they KNOW is going to be incompatible, based on prior experience. Seems to be prudent business practice.

[John Slade]

The Franklin install I saw was direct drive. The IVO prop on full fine pitch got him a very satisfactory static rpm and almost as short a take-off roll as my turbo rotary.

[Andrew Anunson]

There seems to be some quiet curiosity about the Franklin engine. I know that I would really like a more affordable aircraft type engine, especially one smooth enough to work well with an IVO prop. My friend has a Franklin 6 in his STOL Zenith and loves it. He had problems at first getting it to run, but it all turned out to be problems with his airbox design.

I guess we need an engine mount. Hmmm, what else?

[Dust]

Before i would put a franklin on, I would call Nat and ask his opinion of it.

I am laughin my arse off, someone just sent me the write up on the franklin that nat did. heh heh heh, if you are thinkin of one, call him and find out what he really thought!

[TMann]

Originally Posted by Dust

...... if you are thinkin of one, call him and find out what he really thought!

Perhaps Nat found he had made a mistake between the time he spoke with you and he wrote the newsletter?
Maybe (when cooler heads prevailed) he thought more clearly and took a more objective look at the Franklin?

For example ........ in a court of law, which would be admissable as evidence?

I hate to see random bashing of products available to the homebuilders market. It's one thing to criticize when you have had direct experience with the product, but to do so based on heresay is another thing altogether.

Then we get into "Why doesn't anyone make this for the homebuilders market?"
If you want heresay, try this:
There was this guy who bashed a manufacturer on this forum (based on heresay) that over time began to realize that it really was a good product. Now this manufacturer was making a very specialized part (maybe only 1 other manufacturer in the business.) So this guy tries to contact the manufacturer to place an order for this part and guess what? They wouldn't take his calls, answer his email or take an order from him. It turns out the manufacturer is also a (silent) member of this forum.

[Dust]

Nat could not wait to get the Franklin out of his plane, he wanted the performance he was used to with the Lycoming back, simple as that.

I deal in courts of law all the time, if i were to litigate this, i would simply do what i am suggesting, put Nat on the stand and question him directly, just as i have suggested doing here!

I have the utmost respect for Nat, in fact, after i install the blended vert stab and before i fly it, i will call Nat and ask him if he minds me registering it as a Cozy.

If he does, then I will not register it as a cozy, simple as that!

Nat had very little BS in the way he ran his business, i said very little, not none. For example, he always said it was impossible to have a prop strike and i have now found out that you can have one.

He said to me that the canard would stall before the prop could hit.

Do I disrespect him for his little tiny sales statements, NO , in a business where vapor is the standard, he had near no vapor. He is a remarkable person and has my utmost respect!

When Burt went to work for Beech and had to refuse the royalties that Nat owed him, Nat set up a trust for him and later, when he was no longer forced to refuse them by Beech, he paid them to him. Remarkable. In the homebuilt market, he is almost one of a kind!

When I started this forum, I called him and asked him NOT to join. I new we would be talkin mods to his baby, the cozy, and it would by definition offend him.

and that is not something i was ready to do, i would not offend him in any way, he is a very good man. If he was here, i would not talk about changes, simple as that.

[David Clifford]

Originally Posted by Dust

I am laughin my arse off, someone just sent me the write up on the franklin that nat did. heh heh heh, if you are thinkin of one, call him and find out what he really thought!

I'ma laughing my arse off at the thought of you TRYING to put that junk Continental on a Cozy!

[Dust]

Definition of junk continental

have in hand a guarantee that it will work for one year after startup from a reputable aviation salvage yard

Have complete log books showing extensive rebuild with new chrome cylinders, pistons bolts etc 600 hours ago

That be it

[TMann]

Yeah, there was a guy here that tried to get by with a Continental on his Vari-Eze. Spent more of his time dinking with the engine than flying it. Finally pulled it and replaced it with a Lycoming.

He was really put out with the Continental. Said there was no comparison between that and the Lycoming.

DISCALIMER: This post is totally bogus and is designed specifically to demostrated that ANYONE can make unsubstantiated claims without any shred of evidence to support it.
"He said, she said."

Get it?

[Dust]

Yes, doing a one of a kind install is not for the feint of heart, it is a PIA and expensive.

For the little progress i have made on it it has taken a lot of time and mucho dolaros.

the bed mount for a continental is weird lookin, fortunately i had my salvage yard ship me a bent up one to look at, cleared up allot. then there was trying to find someone to bend the chrome moly, BOTH bend shops ruined the expensive chrome moly i supplied them. Fortunately someone i know saw another continental mount that had welded angles instead of bent ones, then it was just a simple mitre joint in steel tube, not, but i finally got er done.

the exhaust is another thing, had to search out a place to buy the flanges and found out the proper size the the tubes, needed 6, 1.5 to 1.75 expanders from 321 stainless, or was it 1.25 to 1.5, mmmm, have to measure, been too long. then it was 2, 3 into one collectors out of 321 with double slip fit joints, $1000 for the two of em and the flanges welded onto the expanders.

Then it was designing the equal length headers out of mandrel bends on my bench. took two weeks of scratchin my head and trying different 2.3, 3, 4 inch radius steel mandrel bends cut to 22.5,45,90,135 angles to get each leg to be 18" and fit beside the bed mount and connect to the 3 into ones.

If you have to figure it out it is real times consuming!

But, gotta say, once i had the header prototyped and the bed part of the mount done - felt dam good! the rest of the exhaust and the mount is simple cut and fit!

[deuskid]

Dust -

This question is sincere: Why go w/ the Continental?

After all the extra work what will it give you that another engine with all of the 'kinks' already worked out will not?

I'd bet you have already stated so somewhere [and I did a quick search but a thread wasn't obvious] and I know you endorse repeat questions anywhoo so I thought I'd ask.

Thanks

John

[neverquit]

This question is sincere: Why go w/ the Continental?

Mike (he said) picked up the Conti close to half the price of a 200 hp Lyco. Has constant speed prop to boot. It's also turbo-ready (minus bucks) and for a high altitude fast flyer his Conti will be a good choice. Aside from that I wish him all the luck. He's got a knowlegeable support team as well, done the homework. I certainly would not do it but its fun to watch and learn.

Why go with Subaru, Franklin, Mazda, Rotax, GM V8? ...... Why build a Cozy when you can buy a GA plane? Hmmmmm...why not?

[Dust]

Well, the answer is quite simple, turbo

lycoming owns the non turbo mkt and continental owns the turbo mkt. the conti has low compression pistons which lessens the risk of detonation.

next is price, lycomings are in high demand by the home built market, conti's are not

engine complete with 1 year guarantee and all accessories, $7,000. All log books, quality rebuilt 600 hours ago

Altho i will put more in modifying the engine than it cost, that is my choice, i want modern attachments, twin turbos to hold power to 25,000 instead of the stock turbo that goes to 18,000 with full power and less as you go from there, electronic turbo control, electronic fuel injection

would i do it again, yep, but, i might look for a different model than the a, but i really love the guarantee. I have a personal mission and the Conti fits in it perfectly

[PaulL]

Originally Posted by Rob Wright

Really? I have sent them a email or two and have gotten no response. I have also sent several emails to Franklin Air ... the US distributer and gotten only one response stating that they have no engines.

Rob,

I just talked to Susan of Franklin Engine Company in Texas (770-386-7435). New production 220HP engines from the new Polish company are not available yet - maybe 6 months or so.

But she has some rebuilt certifieds comming up (about $18K)

She can do better for experimentals where they can optionally install lower compresssion pistons to use with mogas. Standard Franklins have a 10.5 compression ratio and can only use 100LL.

[Rob Wright]

Do they have a website?