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  #1  
Old 06-26-2007, 11:04 AM
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Default Blue Mountain

Last week I stopped out at PTK and visited an RV builder, he was near done, before he decided to pull the blue mountain and switch to advanced flight systems and true track auto pilot.

surprised me to trash $17,000, it did him also!

He had had a lot of install problems, BM is not fully supporting the original stuff, no improvements that were promised, and the internet is full of stories that were discomforting.

He had already decided not to use the engine monitoring of the blue mountain and had gone AFS in the original panel. He had zero problems with the install.

One reason i was still considering the BM was the autopilot with servos for $3,500, the true track with servos cost him about the same!

one good note, he was able to sell his servos for 2,700 so it was ONLY a 17,000 meal
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  #2  
Old 06-26-2007, 11:30 AM
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levansic levansic is offline
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dust View Post
Last week I stopped out at PTK and visited an RV builder, he was near done... BM is not fully supporting the original stuff, no improvements that were promised, and the internet is full of stories that were discomforting.
Wait a second. He is near done now, in 2007, but has an original Blue Mountain unit. This means that he's had the unit for about 4 years before being ready to fly? Also, I thought there was an upgrade program for the original batch, as they were basically beta units. Did he not take advantage of that program?

I guess this just reinforces not buying electronic bits before you need them.

-- Len
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  #3  
Old 06-26-2007, 11:46 AM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

No, not the original 10 beta units, the production unit. The same one i had, big box. I think they were called G3's

The one before the current one that has a processor that looks like a 2D cell flashlight on the back of the display.

Technology - buy it as late in the game as possible
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dust

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  #4  
Old 06-26-2007, 12:22 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

I hate to see Blue Mountain get a bad rap here based on this comparison.
Haven't we seen a string of innovations in our market that may have started out a little shaky, improve over time?
I think that to compare a Blue Mountain avionics system of questionable age to a new off-the-shelf product is a bit unfair.
Most computer based technology is obsolete in about 18 months.
(i.e. never buy a computer on time payments .... you'll never keep up with the depreciation!)

Just an observation ...... I don't own either.
Avionics come last.
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  #5  
Old 06-26-2007, 12:35 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

Nobody was a bigger supporter of greg than i, i put up 3,000 when he started the company for future delivery of an efis one at a prestated price. It was 13,000 at the company startup date.

Two or so years later i was called and told i had to take delivery, although i was no where near needing it, in order to hold the price.

I paid and took delivery.

13,000 for efis one
1,000 for 6 cylinder card
3,500 for the autopilot servos.

I have since sold them and broke even. I understand investing in the future of aviation, been there, done that and as a fluke it worked out well.

Just reporting what i see, his decision surprised the heck outa me
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  #6  
Old 06-26-2007, 04:15 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

The problem is, only the complainers complain on the BMA discussion group. The successful installers rarely report all their easy successes. And you never really hear about the builders who, after THOROUGHLY reading and actually FOLLOWING the instructions, end up with functioning units.
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  #7  
Old 06-26-2007, 04:20 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

Well understood, but, the ability to complain on AFS also exhists on various forums, don't know if afs has a forum, and he reported little or no problems reported with that system.

One item that i don't think can be argued with, the promise of weather and other items on the system that will not be available.

Just another data point, when i am ready again, I'll look around
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dust

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  #8  
Old 06-26-2007, 04:28 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

It was no $13,000.00, its introductory price was around $7,200.00, After I redesigned the packaging it drove the cost up to just under $10,000.00.
...Chrissi
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  #9  
Old 06-26-2007, 04:36 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

Well, that is not what i was told or PAID, from my day one it was 13,000, when i took delivery it was up to 17,000
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dust

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  #10  
Old 06-26-2007, 10:45 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

Whatever you say Dust
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  #11  
Old 06-26-2007, 11:28 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

It was my understanding that a bunch of the hard feelings was due to the fact that BM promised that the older units were upgradable and folks purchased on their reliance on this promise. Now BM is saying the earlier uints are not upgradable and the options BM is offering to the older owners are not instilling owner praise or loyalty.

Thanks Chrissi, I knew I remembered a $7000.00 ish price tag long ago and then suddenly, bam, they were in the low/mid teens. I guess Dust got that second wave. I pull for Greg. I tend to like his eclectic lifestyle....he offered to trade me his original rotary engine he took out of his Cozy when his wife (now ex-wife, I believe) saw my red 65 Mustang ragtop in the background of one of the pictures on my website. Uh, thanks for the offer, but NO. The Mustang is due for a RE-restoration once the plane is....uh, finished (?).

All that being said, I love my Dynon D-100 and so far Dynon has been very supportive and seemingly devoted to their current customer base. I have had my unit for about a year and the firmware upgrades have been free with a bunch of new features and now new hardware that works with the current units in modular forms. It is not as enclusive as the BM or OP etc, but for the money it is amazing to me how kewl it is.

No, I havn't flown my yet, BUT today I did get to fly a friends RV-8 with the same Dynon EFIS I have and it is SWEEEET. Not only am I amazed with its wonderful presentaion and ability so is the guy who owns the plane I flew. That may not be a big deal in itself except he is a first officer for Continintal Airlines and he has nothing but praise for the unit. By the way, the RV-8 really is a fun plane to fly....not a canard, but damn it is a fine plane.

Chris
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  #12  
Old 06-26-2007, 11:40 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cozy Girrrl View Post
... its introductory price was around $7,200.00, After I redesigned the packaging it drove the cost up to just under $10,000.00.
...Chrissi
You're too kind!

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  #13  
Old 06-27-2007, 12:31 AM
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David Staten David Staten is offline
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

Quote:
Originally Posted by TMann View Post
I hate to see Blue Mountain get a bad rap here based on this comparison.
Haven't we seen a string of innovations in our market that may have started out a little shaky, improve over time?
I think that to compare a Blue Mountain avionics system of questionable age to a new off-the-shelf product is a bit unfair.
Most computer based technology is obsolete in about 18 months.
(i.e. never buy a computer on time payments .... you'll never keep up with the depreciation!)

Just an observation ...... I don't own either.
Avionics come last.
Blue Mountain has done it to themselves, and not in just this one instance. There has been rumors in the listserv's about folks pondering legal action because previous marketing material said one thing, and the company is now saying another.

The facts of the matter as they have been explained to me in these groups are that the early gen units are not upgradeable from a hardware standpoint, and many of the late gen units have features that cannot be run on the early gen units. Unfortunately, the perception of the promise of upgradeability was the prime reason that many early generation customers bought their boxes when they did. The early gen's processor/guts are no longer made (the manufacturer of that component is gone).

It sucks all the way around. Chris and I were on the fence between BMA and Dynon for a long time. We went with Dynon as soon as the 7" display came out, and while we havent flown, we have been nothing but impressed and pleased with the support given to us by Dynon.

The lesson here: Marketing only tells one side of the story. The customer base tells the rest. If you are an initial customer, you are taking some risk. Any promises that are made.. need to be in writing, and save the writing, on paper.
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  #14  
Old 06-28-2007, 11:07 AM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

Yeah - he is pondering on wether to join the suit.

Also nice to know that i got in with my 3 grand at $6,000 higher than others!

Sometimes it is good to be able to remake decisions, wish i could do it more, there are a number of things i would change in the past ifin i could!
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dust

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  #15  
Old 06-29-2007, 03:41 PM
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Default Re: Blue Mountain

Yea, I'm currently on the fence with them. I like the folks, and I think it's a good product, but I also got caught in the "bought the unit based on what it could do and promised/implied upgradeability" and now that I'm ready to fly with my G3, it can't do weather with ADI terrain, etc. I don't mind spending some money to get required upgrades, but their current offering is too high for me (basically 1/3 credit towards a new unit).

B
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